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Post by BMus1 on Mar 24, 2023 23:16:14 GMT
I'd love to see them get with a producer and maybe have a big name assistant engineer. Like someone who only Metallica could hire as an "assistant". They won't be straying from their comfort zone at HQ anytime soon but getting new ears in the room would go a long way. As they get older too I wouldn't be surprised if the band would become more open to some outside help.
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Post by silentflames on Mar 25, 2023 2:14:10 GMT
I always wonder if this "lack" of excitement/ moderate excitement could also be put down to the sign of times (how internet works now), us being older (late 30s/ over 40 for the most part), etc. I'm always excited for new Metallica stuff, but I gotta admit I go thru phases too. Compared to the anticipation of St. Anger and DM, I'd say my levels of hype are not that high. We'll have to check the whole album, 1/4 is not enough to pass final judgement. Regardless of how good it may be, the boys should start looking to work with a different producer so as to keep things fresh. They've been working with Greg since 2006. Brendan O'Brien, Steve Albini, Butch Vig, Brian Eno (?) might be good options. Whoever helped produce Tool's Fear Inoculum album. |
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Post by GuybrushX McMurphy on Mar 25, 2023 4:17:07 GMT
I also don't feel as "hyped" as I usually do when they release a new album, and I think the reasons are pretty obvious. The previous albums always felt like a monumental event that represented the next step in the band's evolution on their way back to former glory. Partly because of the long time that usually passes between their releases and partly because, ever since St. Anger, each album promised to fix some big issues that the fans had yearned for years to be fixed, resulting in a "they're back for REAL this time" mindset. This one on the other hand does not feel like a new chapter at all, nor like something that improves on their previous release. On the contrary. After the Loads, most fans wanted them to make more aggressive metal music again. After an (then) unusually long wait, St. Anger promised to deliver exactly that, but it turned out that it was also lacking in composition and production quality, and was a far cry from their masterpieces of the 80s. So the "goal" shifted to everyone wanting them to keep that aggression, but to write more cohesive songs with better song structures, better riffs, solos, great production, and all the other ingredients that had gone missing. I remember people saying that St. Anger was merely the album that brought them back on track and would pave the way for a follow-up that was to be the real pay-off. Then Death Magnetic basically delivered better songwriting and a return to something more resembling their original style, but the production was awful. So everyone's minds once again shifted to "I hope they can keep this style, but improve the production next time". This was delivered on Hardwired, particularly on disc 1. However, with all of the glaring issues superficially fixed, this was basically the endpoint of the described evolution. This was pretty much the best they could do and it was clear that this would likely be the closest they would ever get back to what they once were. It seems like both to the fans and, more importantly, the band itself, Hardwired basically represents their final form; an amalgam of all their previous styles, presented in decently cohesive, albeit mostly not very creative songs with pretty good, but generic production. The new singles seem to confirm this by not sounding like the next step in an evolution or the next big chapter in the band's history, but like a continuation of the previous chapter in a watered down way. They feel more like Hardwired disc 3 (or disc 4, if we count the cover versions / live bonus cd) than a real new album. For the first time since St. Anger, this feels like a standstill or even a step back rather than a major improvement. And for the first time in the band's entire history, I think they've finally gotten to the point where they are content with a certain style - both in terms of songwriting and production - and just stick with that. It could have happened after 1991, with them just continuing to churn out lesser, watered down versions of the Black Album, but they were still more ambitious then and opted for the much maligned experimental route. Also, they were obviously huge in the 90s, but still felt like a real band with music as the main interest that everything else revolved around. In the past years though, they have felt more like a corporation with the band members being mere representatives of that corporation, trying to sell cigars, whiskey, bobbleheads and whatnot, and this current by the numbers music functions as yet another addition to their extensive product lineup. Personally, I think there would actually have been a lot of room for improvement musically. I've always thought that an ideal album for this era would be one where they basically picked up where they left off with the highlights of the Load era (Bleeding Me, Outlaw Torn, Fixxxer, Where the Wild Things are etc.) and combined the creative, intricate, dark songwriting and lyricism and the layered production of those with the more metal approach that they rediscovered throughout the 2000s. Had the new singles been anything like that, I would certainly be hyped. However, while they're now indeed combining elements of the Loads with elements of their original thrash metal style, all the best aspects seem to be lost. There are no real ideas, the riffs are very generic, samey and "stock", the lyrics aren't exactly subtle, the production has no depth or layers at all and there's obviously no creativity with the drumming, let alone with those improvised solos. So it all feels more like metalized, simplistic equivalents to Cure or Bad Seed rather than the aforementioned tracks. And while I still somewhat enjoy listening to the new songs, simply because they have a certain core sound that's unique to Metallica, this album doesn't feel like an upcoming highlight at all.
Maybe they did indeed opt to release the most easily digestible songs as singles and keep all the real gems hidden on the album, but that's most likely far-fetched wishful thinking at this point. Still looking forward to the album and there will possibly be a few songs that are unexpectedly great, but at this point there's just not much that hints towards it.
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Post by ford71V8 on Mar 25, 2023 4:27:33 GMT
Good summary dude... I think what I am craving from them is similar to what you describe in your 2nd to last paragraph
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Post by BMus1 on Mar 25, 2023 5:03:19 GMT
Damn that's a very good post.
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Post by silentflames on Mar 25, 2023 5:32:48 GMT
Maybe they're releasing easily-digestible, accessible songs to cater to the ever-dwindling rock/metal fanbase that has shifted into a more mainstream sound?
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Post by Zalman on Mar 25, 2023 6:16:03 GMT
That post described my thoughts better than I ever could, dang.
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Post by Kimbo on Mar 25, 2023 6:34:53 GMT
Tldr
Then I saw the following comments. Now I have to read it, dammit
Edit
Agreed, that was a very very good post. Well done dude, you probably nailed down exactly how most if us feel
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Post by Kimbo on Mar 25, 2023 6:41:59 GMT
Maybe they're releasing easily-digestible, accessible songs to cater to the ever-dwindling rock/metal fanbase that has shifted into a more mainstream sound? There’s nothing easily-digested with the Darkness solo though. |
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Post by Awake on Mar 25, 2023 9:06:39 GMT
By the way there is a really good interview with Butch Vig on RickBeato's channel..... lots of great info and stories Garbage. |
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Post by slowdive on Mar 25, 2023 20:21:05 GMT
I'm sure they have their shipments unmarked and locked up tight, only to be labeled and shipped overnight before the release. Metallica are control freaks, and have the money to be control freaks to the max. Not possible. They send everything with weeks in advance, can't risk missing the release date. Besides, they also send early copies for journalists. Probably some leaks come from there. |
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Post by Wolfish on Mar 26, 2023 21:19:35 GMT
Rumour has it a 4th single will see the light of day this Friday, March 31st -- Too Far Gone?
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Post by ModerusPrime on Mar 27, 2023 1:26:45 GMT
I agree with everything that long ass post says other than disc 2 of Hardwired being less than disc 1. I never understood that sentiment. Both discs have their good songs and meh songs.
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Post by silentflames on Mar 27, 2023 6:01:08 GMT
I can't believe we're less than 3 weeks away. Something has to happen between now and the release date to fan the flames of suspense.
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Post by Kimbo on Mar 27, 2023 10:21:30 GMT
Rumour has it a 4th single will see the light of day this Friday, March 31st -- Too Far Gone?I'd rather not have anymore songs at this point, leave the rest for the premiere please |
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Post by silentflames on Mar 27, 2023 11:12:49 GMT
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Post by SicJes on Mar 27, 2023 11:32:39 GMT
Hardwired part 2
Sounds sick. We're almost there boys and girls!
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Post by silentflames on Mar 27, 2023 11:35:04 GMT
Feels like Spit Out The Bone or a better My Apocalypse.
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Post by SicJes on Mar 27, 2023 11:38:10 GMT
Sounds exactly like Hardwired. It'll probably have the exact same solo as well 😂
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Post by Zalman on Mar 27, 2023 11:53:15 GMT
Cool riff.
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Post by SicJes on Mar 27, 2023 12:14:30 GMT
Troll level 1000 right here
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Post by BMus1 on Mar 27, 2023 12:23:16 GMT
Sounds cool. This more than any other preview makes me wish the production sounded different than HTSD, or they tuned back down to Eb.
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Post by fistakiller on Mar 27, 2023 12:58:39 GMT
Nice riff. Hope we don't hear it a million times in the song though.
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Post by silentflames on Mar 27, 2023 13:34:51 GMT
Nice riff. Hope we don't hear it a million times in the song though. The song slows down at the end, so hopefully it's a bridge riff. |
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Post by jorn on Mar 27, 2023 14:10:02 GMT
I also don't feel as "hyped" as I usually do when they release a new album, and I think the reasons are pretty obvious. The previous albums always felt like a monumental event that represented the next step in the band's evolution on their way back to former glory. Partly because of the long time that usually passes between their releases and partly because, ever since St. Anger, each album promised to fix some big issues that the fans had yearned for years to be fixed, resulting in a "they're back for REAL this time" mindset. This one on the other hand does not feel like a new chapter at all, nor like something that improves on their previous release. On the contrary. After the Loads, most fans wanted them to make more aggressive metal music again. After an (then) unusually long wait, St. Anger promised to deliver exactly that, but it turned out that it was also lacking in composition and production quality, and was a far cry from their masterpieces of the 80s. So the "goal" shifted to everyone wanting them to keep that aggression, but to write more cohesive songs with better song structures, better riffs, solos, great production, and all the other ingredients that had gone missing. I remember people saying that St. Anger was merely the album that brought them back on track and would pave the way for a follow-up that was to be the real pay-off. Then Death Magnetic basically delivered better songwriting and a return to something more resembling their original style, but the production was awful. So everyone's minds once again shifted to "I hope they can keep this style, but improve the production next time". This was delivered on Hardwired, particularly on disc 1. However, with all of the glaring issues superficially fixed, this was basically the endpoint of the described evolution. This was pretty much the best they could do and it was clear that this would likely be the closest they would ever get back to what they once were. It seems like both to the fans and, more importantly, the band itself, Hardwired basically represents their final form; an amalgam of all their previous styles, presented in decently cohesive, albeit mostly not very creative songs with pretty good, but generic production. The new singles seem to confirm this by not sounding like the next step in an evolution or the next big chapter in the band's history, but like a continuation of the previous chapter in a watered down way. They feel more like Hardwired disc 3 (or disc 4, if we count the cover versions / live bonus cd) than a real new album. For the first time since St. Anger, this feels like a standstill or even a step back rather than a major improvement. And for the first time in the band's entire history, I think they've finally gotten to the point where they are content with a certain style - both in terms of songwriting and production - and just stick with that. It could have happened after 1991, with them just continuing to churn out lesser, watered down versions of the Black Album, but they were still more ambitious then and opted for the much maligned experimental route. Also, they were obviously huge in the 90s, but still felt like a real band with music as the main interest that everything else revolved around. In the past years though, they have felt more like a corporation with the band members being mere representatives of that corporation, trying to sell cigars, whiskey, bobbleheads and whatnot, and this current by the numbers music functions as yet another addition to their extensive product lineup. Personally, I think there would actually have been a lot of room for improvement musically. I've always thought that an ideal album for this era would be one where they basically picked up where they left off with the highlights of the Load era (Bleeding Me, Outlaw Torn, Fixxxer, Where the Wild Things are etc.) and combined the creative, intricate, dark songwriting and lyricism and the layered production of those with the more metal approach that they rediscovered throughout the 2000s. Had the new singles been anything like that, I would certainly be hyped. However, while they're now indeed combining elements of the Loads with elements of their original thrash metal style, all the best aspects seem to be lost. There are no real ideas, the riffs are very generic, samey and "stock", the lyrics aren't exactly subtle, the production has no depth or layers at all and there's obviously no creativity with the drumming, let alone with those improvised solos. So it all feels more like metalized, simplistic equivalents to Cure or Bad Seed rather than the aforementioned tracks. And while I still somewhat enjoy listening to the new songs, simply because they have a certain core sound that's unique to Metallica, this album doesn't feel like an upcoming highlight at all.
Maybe they did indeed opt to release the most easily digestible songs as singles and keep all the real gems hidden on the album, but that's most likely far-fetched wishful thinking at this point. Still looking forward to the album and there will possibly be a few songs that are unexpectedly great, but at this point there's just not much that hints towards it.
Brilliant post. Well done! I couldn't do it better myself. Absolutely brilliant. In their defense, though...they sort of tried the aspect you defined with the collaboration with Lou Reed. From the musical point of view, it is one of their most unique and creative products. I am not talking about the vocals or the lyrical content but the music on it could be considered one of their boldest and most creative compositions. |
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Post by BMus1 on Mar 27, 2023 15:19:41 GMT
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Post by davi84 on Mar 27, 2023 16:52:03 GMT
I also don't feel as "hyped" as I usually do when they release a new album, and I think the reasons are pretty obvious. The previous albums always felt like a monumental event that represented the next step in the band's evolution on their way back to former glory. Partly because of the long time that usually passes between their releases and partly because, ever since St. Anger, each album promised to fix some big issues that the fans had yearned for years to be fixed, resulting in a "they're back for REAL this time" mindset. This one on the other hand does not feel like a new chapter at all, nor like something that improves on their previous release. On the contrary. After the Loads, most fans wanted them to make more aggressive metal music again. After an (then) unusually long wait, St. Anger promised to deliver exactly that, but it turned out that it was also lacking in composition and production quality, and was a far cry from their masterpieces of the 80s. So the "goal" shifted to everyone wanting them to keep that aggression, but to write more cohesive songs with better song structures, better riffs, solos, great production, and all the other ingredients that had gone missing. I remember people saying that St. Anger was merely the album that brought them back on track and would pave the way for a follow-up that was to be the real pay-off. Then Death Magnetic basically delivered better songwriting and a return to something more resembling their original style, but the production was awful. So everyone's minds once again shifted to "I hope they can keep this style, but improve the production next time". This was delivered on Hardwired, particularly on disc 1. However, with all of the glaring issues superficially fixed, this was basically the endpoint of the described evolution. This was pretty much the best they could do and it was clear that this would likely be the closest they would ever get back to what they once were. It seems like both to the fans and, more importantly, the band itself, Hardwired basically represents their final form; an amalgam of all their previous styles, presented in decently cohesive, albeit mostly not very creative songs with pretty good, but generic production. The new singles seem to confirm this by not sounding like the next step in an evolution or the next big chapter in the band's history, but like a continuation of the previous chapter in a watered down way. They feel more like Hardwired disc 3 (or disc 4, if we count the cover versions / live bonus cd) than a real new album. For the first time since St. Anger, this feels like a standstill or even a step back rather than a major improvement. And for the first time in the band's entire history, I think they've finally gotten to the point where they are content with a certain style - both in terms of songwriting and production - and just stick with that. It could have happened after 1991, with them just continuing to churn out lesser, watered down versions of the Black Album, but they were still more ambitious then and opted for the much maligned experimental route. Also, they were obviously huge in the 90s, but still felt like a real band with music as the main interest that everything else revolved around. In the past years though, they have felt more like a corporation with the band members being mere representatives of that corporation, trying to sell cigars, whiskey, bobbleheads and whatnot, and this current by the numbers music functions as yet another addition to their extensive product lineup. Personally, I think there would actually have been a lot of room for improvement musically. I've always thought that an ideal album for this era would be one where they basically picked up where they left off with the highlights of the Load era (Bleeding Me, Outlaw Torn, Fixxxer, Where the Wild Things are etc.) and combined the creative, intricate, dark songwriting and lyricism and the layered production of those with the more metal approach that they rediscovered throughout the 2000s. Had the new singles been anything like that, I would certainly be hyped. However, while they're now indeed combining elements of the Loads with elements of their original thrash metal style, all the best aspects seem to be lost. There are no real ideas, the riffs are very generic, samey and "stock", the lyrics aren't exactly subtle, the production has no depth or layers at all and there's obviously no creativity with the drumming, let alone with those improvised solos. So it all feels more like metalized, simplistic equivalents to Cure or Bad Seed rather than the aforementioned tracks. And while I still somewhat enjoy listening to the new songs, simply because they have a certain core sound that's unique to Metallica, this album doesn't feel like an upcoming highlight at all.
Maybe they did indeed opt to release the most easily digestible songs as singles and keep all the real gems hidden on the album, but that's most likely far-fetched wishful thinking at this point. Still looking forward to the album and there will possibly be a few songs that are unexpectedly great, but at this point there's just not much that hints towards it.
I follow this forum since the late 90's, when it was still part of the official Metallica site. I was never a very active member, but always read everything. The very few times I've tried to express how I feel about the band's trajectory, I think I've never could do it so clearly and fairly as this guy... Maybe because my English isn't that good, maybe because there was too much passion clouding my thoughts when I was writing. But then this guy came and just did it for me, after all these years. Thanks man! |
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Post by Zalman on Mar 27, 2023 17:49:05 GMT
A ton to dig into here. Seems like Rob was the one to really convince Lars that it was time to write new music, so major props to him. And Inamorata sounds super interesting based on that description. Also, James seems to believe Screaming Suicide will be "the one" live. I don't see it, but hey, maybe I'm wrong. |
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Post by Kimbo on Mar 27, 2023 17:55:28 GMT
I was soooo excited reading that Rob interview... Up until he said that SS would be the live banger... Then my hype quickly faded.
Still looking forward to those bass breakdowns though
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Post by BMus1 on Mar 27, 2023 18:39:29 GMT
I was soooo excited reading that Rob interview... Up until he said that SS would be the live banger... Then my hype quickly faded. Still looking forward to those bass breakdowns though That killed my hype but then I remembered Lux is a better live song than SS too, I just don't trust their judgment. |
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